Comments on: ndp and liberals searching for a pulse on the prairies.

By: Tom G

Tom G — Mon, 02 Jul 2012 04:30:50 +0000

Like it or not, branding matters. The Liberal brand in Alberta is burned beyond saving.
The current NDP federal leader is doing a fine job of burning the brand in Alberta too.
Why is branding important? Sadly, some voters give no more thought to their ballot choice than they would picking their breakfast cereal. So, NDP or Liberal: which party will be first to change their name to Fruit Loops? Or maybe you should go with something flakier.

By: Martin Levenson

Martin Levenson — Mon, 02 Jul 2012 01:06:55 +0000

Sorry Alex, but I think you’re just wrong. People who are “more successful” are very rarely so on their own; there are legal and economic institutions and structures and, probably most importantly, other people who make them so. If that wasn’t the case, everybody would be “successful” simply by virtue of working hard, then everybody would be successful. I can tell you I know a LOT of really hard-working people who aren’t what many people would consider “succesful”.

It is the state that creates the conditions and institutions that make it possible for people to acheive “success”. It is the state that provides education and training for potential employees of any enterprise.

It is the state that protects private property through things like police forces and legal instruments like torts or land titles, etc. It is the state that provides infrastructure like roads or sewers that benefit those that depend on suppliers or a mobile labour force far in excess of those who don’t.

It is the state, in Canada at least, that provides health care(although not “perfect”) at an affordable price that is certainly preferable to filling the pockets of health insurance company shareholders, and MUCH more efficiently than what we see in the US.

It is the state that upholds bankruptcy laws, which allows people to walk away from unsuccessful enterprises with little or no personal consequence, free to try again. It is the state that provides Workers’ Compensation Boards, so that companies don’t have to fear lawsuits for maintaining unsafe work sites, as they do in the United States…where in many cases, safer work sites are consequently more prevelant than in Canada.

So I think that it is MORE than reasonable that those who benefit MOST from the activities of the state, even if they don’t actually recognize it or are ideologically blind to it, should pay a larger portion of their income to the state in the form of progressive taxation.

There are VERY few people who ACTUALLY “pull themselves up by the bootstraps” without help or assistance from state institutions and a whole lot of other people.

By: Shannon Phillips

Shannon Phillips — Sat, 30 Jun 2012 23:28:38 +0000

Graham (above) is right. The NDP needs to be able to talk about the energy economy in a way that recognizes its importance to people’s paycheques and families, recognizes we need to use that wealth to build a bridge to a greener economy, and recognizes we own those resources and can make different choices with them.

I’ve been thinking about organizing a two-day event for the NDYA on understanding the energy economy, or something, in conjunction with the Suncor workers, the enviro groups, and my own employer, the AFL, on how we get our heads around talking about energy in a way that connects with people out here. Because it’s not just Alberta – it’s also good chunks of SK and BC where the NDP needs to get it right. Anyway I am just thinking aloud about this.

Anyway, nice post, Dave, and thanks for the great comment, Graham. Now I shall brace myself for all manner of rude trolling by people bleating about the NEP. Bleat away, trollers, I’m gone on holidays for the weekend…
Shannon Phillips

By: jerrymacgp

jerrymacgp — Sat, 30 Jun 2012 14:11:38 +0000

Dear @Alex: the NDP are never going to accept your premise. Progressive taxation, in which those who can most afford it pay higher taxes than those who can least afford it, is at the heart of the New Democrat view of a just approach to public financing. We’re never going to get your vote either; I can accept that; we don’t need it anyway.

By: Denny

Denny — Sat, 30 Jun 2012 04:27:02 +0000

Coyne vs. Trudeau could lead to some awkward family-related moments.

By: Jon Adams

Jon Adams — Sat, 30 Jun 2012 03:50:13 +0000

The NEP?

Turn the freaking page, already.

By: bartinsky

bartinsky — Sat, 30 Jun 2012 03:20:09 +0000

A lieberals election wins chances in Alberta, where we still remember the “NEP”, are as good as Dions green shaft being heralded in the Cenovus boardroom, give it up Boob Rae, don;t matter if it is you, little Justine or his sister in law mother in law stepmother Deborah Coyne and her lib-sucking brother all run together naked with Rick Mercer jumping into some CBC lake, YOU STILL WON’T WIN,, it is over, Canadians will never go back to failure and theft and graft and lies, need I go on.

By: Alex

Alex — Sat, 30 Jun 2012 01:25:24 +0000

Until the NDP and Liberals recognize that progressive tax systems are inherently immoral because, for example, they indicate that less successful people are more entitled to money than those who earn it (a violation of property rights), they will not have success in Alberta, a place where people actually earn their money.

By: Graham

Graham — Fri, 29 Jun 2012 22:05:10 +0000

To me, the key to NDP success in the prairies, is to recognize that there are a lot of people out here who enjoy the fruits of the labour (word chosen deliberately) of those working in the oilsands, but are also believers in climate change and socially progressive politics. It’s a hard line to straddle, but I think people are hungry for someone to do it. Maybe not enough to win a majority of seats in Alberta even on a cold day in hell, but enough to make a dent and broaden the constituency of the progressive parties to include westerners.

By: Brad Lafortune

Brad Lafortune — Fri, 29 Jun 2012 17:51:03 +0000

Hey Dave!

This is a great early post on the long and difficult road that the NDP (and the Liberals) must begin to travel on today (well, maybe even yesterday, or how about last week?) in the lead up to the next Federal election. I know the NDP base feels that it’s high-time for some serious reaching out to new communities of potential supporters–not only placing our ideas and histories in front of them, but learning together about what progressive politics means in the context of low voter turnout, an attendant turn to issues-based activism, and the shared belief (however shaky) that Harper’s policies and agenda (whatever it is) are unacceptable to Canadians and Westerners.

Of course, it wasn’t that the NDP forgot about the Prairies and the West (though there may be some who understandably feel that way), but for the past several years it’s become increasingly out of reach given the general perception that Harper was a strong response the alienation effect (real or imagined) the federal Liberals left in their wake.

In any case, here we are today, and there certainly is real and exciting momentum building in the Prairies. Just the other night, we held a very busy and energetic town hall regarding Bill C38 at the Arts Barns on June 27th, which focused on new strategies for outreach and building (that good, tried and tested social movement approach to politics). Linda Duncan MP for Strathcona summed it up well when she underlined the renewed energy in Edmonton and on the Prairies for a resistant and hopeful politics that will lead us up to 2015. The task now, she recognized, is to keep the issues alive inside Bill C38 and other pieces of CPC legislation. It’s going to be a challenge, but it’s the task before us now.

So, here we are three (hopefully not four) years out from the next election. We know our (the NDP’s, though as you point out Dave, this applies to the Libs as well) numbers and results were not the most heartening on the Prairies in 2011. But we also know that we have a deep history of a type of politics built on listening, collaborating with various social movements (think the UFA, the Ind. Labour Party, and the LSR), and proposing progressive and hopeful alternatives.

Finally, I think there is now another important piece to add to the puzzle of the Prairies: young activists and politicos who understand, viscerally, that the status quo is not working for them. The task is not simply to recognize this diverse group of disillusioned citizens (we constantly pay lip service to low voter turnout among certain communities; we KNOW this is the case), but we must reach out to them, over and over again, and listen to their ideas for organizing, growing, and creating progressive roots in our communities. We have so much to learn in common with each other.

Shameless plug: @LdeclarationNDP (Twitter)

lethrbidgedeclaration (Facebook)

Lethbridgedeclaration.ca

Brad Lafortune

(end rant)

By: Barry

Barry — Fri, 29 Jun 2012 17:14:48 +0000

Meanwhile the centrist creed of parties such as the Liberals elect us so that we can show you what we will do in power.